Advancing Aviation Security Against the Dangers of Thermal Runaway

Join the crucial conversation with Lithium Fireguard's Nick Dunbar as we tackle the harrowing yet necessary topic of lithium battery fires in aviation. Every day, our personal electronic devices carry the potential for thermal runaway, a destructive reaction within lithium cells that can lead to fires and explosions. These aren't just risks to our gadgets but to the lives aboard aircraft. Through this episode, you'll grasp the gravity of the situation and the innovative measures being taken to contain it, such as the Lithium Fireguard PG-100 containment box. It's a dialogue that promises to ignite awareness and arm you with knowledge about this invisible threat that flies with us.

We go beyond mere discussion, scrutinizing the PG-100's design elements, from its cost-effective approach to its robust construction, ensuring its adaptability across various aircraft. Hear firsthand how this device could mitigate the substantial financial and operational repercussions of in-flight emergencies. Our exchange with Nick also extends to the Racklin box, exploring its potential in altering safety protocols in urban environments, much like it aims to do in the skies. The growing dependency on electronics calls for intuitive emergency procedures, which we are pushing to become as common as the household fire extinguisher. Engage with us as we examine the proactive steps being taken to safeguard our increasingly digital lives against the volatile nature of lithium batteries.

Learn more here: 

More about the PG100 and Lithium Fire Guard:

https://www.lithiumfireguard.com/

Other fire suppression devices from LithCon:

https://lithcon.us/

Chapters

• 0:00 Lithium Battery Fire Safety in Aviation
• 15:54 Lithium Battery Fire Suppression System
• 26:57 Lithium Fireguard and Racklin Box

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:00

You're listening to the Pilot Photog Podcast, where every airplane has a story. Hi, everyone, thanks for joining the Pilot Photog Podcast. My guest today is Nick Dunbar. He is the VP of Sales for a company called Lithium Fireguard. Hi, nick, thanks for joining. Hey, juan, thanks so much for having me. So tell us a little bit about your company, lithium Fireguard. What is it that you do and what's the safety issue that you are trying to mitigate?

Speaker 2: 0:27

Yeah, absolutely so. The product we're specifically discussing today is the Lithium Fire Guard PG-100. So what? Our product is a containment box and it can be applied to different scenarios, but we're going to kind of focus on the aviation here. But you know, it's a box, it's a reactive box. So if a ped portable electronic device, a lithium battery, goes into thermal runaway, we are a device that that can capture it and put it out and contain it so that our flights don't have to turn around and that in-flight passengers, pilots, cargo et cetera are safe. So that's kind of the quick spiel on it.

Speaker 1: 1:21

Excellent, and from what you sent me here, lithium battery fires in the cockpit and cabin have been quickly become one of the most dangerous threats in aviation. Basically, these lithium batteries are all around us, right even in everyday life, and, as you point out in your press release here, all industry segments commercial, cargo, business and military can be subject to lithium battery fires. So can you go into a little bit of overall detail about how lithium battery fires can start and why they're just so prevalent in all our devices now?

Speaker 2: 1:55

Yeah, so it's a funny world, because it's one of those things where I can never get on a plane again and not think of you know where, where I would kick the iPad if it started to go into thermal right away and wondering what, what kind of containment device they have on board, and and so it's a slippery slope when it comes to awareness, and I'm shocked at and I was one of those and how little awareness there is regarding these fires. Um. So lithium batteries are everywhere, um, they're in our phones, they're in our ipads, they're in our laptops, they're in vapes and e-cigarettes, and and that's the reason why they don't they want you to not check any of those devices they want them on board so that if something in the cabin, so if, if one of them does start to go into thermal runaway, then then we have an opportunity to sort of address it or deal with it, because it's not just under the plane with all the cargo. So what thermal runaway is is basically a distribute, a disruption in the cell, and all these batteries have multiple cells in them, um, and, and so there's some type of um disruption within the cell and it goes into what's called thermal runaway, and so the thermal runaway will start to smoke and then eventually it will ignite. And um, there's some crazy footage out there.

Speaker 2: 3:27

If you, if you go on youtube or the internet and and look at um, a battery and thermal runaway, it's literally like a bomb.

Speaker 2: 3:35

I mean it has kind of like a m80 firework or something like that, because there are multiple cells in all these batteries, so once one ignites, the other can propagate, and it can propagate and the other cells can begin to catch on fire, explode as well, and so they say these devices can propagate for up to six hours. My gosh, yeah, so it's. I mean, it's totally nuts. And then the gas that comes off of these is like sort of like a precursor to mustard gas, very, very toxic gas, and they will occasionally explode, which ours did when we were getting our underwriter laboratory certificate certification, which I'll go into later.

Speaker 2: 4:25

But when the battery explodes, we had some ballistics to look into, kind of what the velocity was, and the velocity was 300 meters per second. To put that into perspective of nine millimeter gun is 360 meters per second, yeah, and but but the mass of, of, of the battery that is is, is, is, you know, similar to like a, a double a battery. So so, so think of, you know, a nine millimeter velocity, with the massive of double a battery shooting in any direction.

Speaker 1: 5:02

It's it's very, very scary, yeah, that that is a.

Speaker 2: 5:11

A new fear has been unlocked. I understand.

Speaker 1: 5:13

Yeah, like now, when you get an airplane, you see all these, you know devices everywhere. Um, that, that's a very big concern. And of course you mentioned it's not just a fire but the smoke or the fumes that can, that can incapacitate or even kill somebody, right it's extremely dangerous and I mean you got to think when you travel.

Speaker 2: 5:31

I mean, every person on the plane probably has three to six lithium batteries yeah each.

Speaker 2: 5:38

And you know it was interesting. We had heard from um, uh, you know, I can't say their name but a major cell phone and battery provider. One out of 10,000 of the cells that they create for their batteries is, you know, malfunctional. So, and then you think about, you know, these batteries for, like, a Tesla battery for, for, for an e-bike, I mean, that has hundreds of these cells in there, and and the phones have, you know, six to 15. And and and so there's, you know, one out of 10,000 of each of these cells has, you know, is known to be malfunctional, and they still send them out. So, you know it's. This is something that that we're going to see more prevalent, especially as the world moves, you know, because obviously we feel like electric is a more sustainable resource because of solar and all that. And their lithium batteries are here to stay. All of our construction material, all of those things, their lithium batteries are here to stay.

Speaker 1: 6:45

All of our construction material, all of those things are lithium batteries so this is I mean, it's everywhere right cordless tools, cell phones, even those uh portable battery chargers that people carry to keep charging their phone when they're traveling, those are all?

Speaker 2: 7:00

those are some of the most dangerous devices are our portable battery chargers.

Speaker 1: 7:06

Really.

Speaker 2: 7:07

Yep, and that's when. So, when the FAA and I sent over our test to you the FAA right now is this is a huge, huge issue. And so when the FAA has been doing tests on different containment devices and things like that, and you know, ours was, of course, um, uh, very unexciting because our, our, uh product worked, you know, as it should, and and um. But when they test these, that's what they use, uh are those battery chargers and they heat them up to get them to go into thermal runaway and and they leave in the box and once they explode, they see, you know, the box contains the flames if it contains the gas, et cetera. So that's what they're using because they, they, those are things that are kind of primary, to cook to, to go up.

Speaker 1: 7:57

Yeah, they're likely candidates, right.

Speaker 2: 8:00

Exactly.

Speaker 1: 8:01

So, nick tell me I mean, this is something you can't throw water on it. You can't put it like a traditional fire. You can, Nick, tell me I mean this is something you can't throw water on it. You can't put it like a traditional fire. You can't use baking soda like a grease fire. How do you? You've mentioned containment, but how exactly does your device work and stop these runaway events from occurring?

Speaker 2: 8:15

Yeah, so you know, the thing to consider is all these devices are made to not absorb water. Right, Like they. We want them to be as waterproof as possible. Right, like they. We want them to be as waterproof as possible, right, and and so. So you know the only. And they create their own oxygen. So you can't just suffocate them and put you know, because they create their own oxygen. So so what, what? What? The only way to really get the thermal runaway to stop is to cool it. Really get the thermal runaway to stop is is to cool it.

Speaker 2: 8:50

Okay, so how our device works is is it's basically, you know it's, it's a box and you, you open the box.

Speaker 2: 8:54

It's got two slides on each side and the box opens and then there's a little plastic screen that that is um, uh, in the center once you open it, and then you put the box over the device and then you close it and there's a, so the screen's there to protect in case it blows up.

Speaker 2: 9:14

And then there's a little ramp that when you close the box, it kind of puts the ped into the box, and I mean the box almost looks like a, like an old school boom box or something like that.

Speaker 2: 9:23

Um and you know I'm sure there'll be links, links so you guys can take a look and and then we have two um charcoal filters on there to filter out, because we have to let let air out, because otherwise it's just a ticking time bomb so that that filters out the gas. And then there's a little bit of a nozzle and with that you put in water to completely submerge it, and and then we have handles that you can just carry the box and take it to the back of the plane. And so at that point you know it's fully submerged, it's contained, it's any gas that's coming is getting filtered and it'll slowly cool as it's completely submerged in water and that also puts the fire out as well, and then it's contained in this box. And then it's contained in this box and since it's completely submerged in water and contained, that's going to mitigate the potential of it propagating again as well.

Speaker 1: 10:27

So it sounds like God forbid. If this were to happen in a flight a commercial flight, let's say and they had a PG-100 handy, they could contain the device, stop it and the flight could proceed as normal or continue as normal.

Speaker 2: 10:41

Absolutely, and that's so. That's what different, our main differential is. You know, everybody else has these containment bags, right, and the FAA has has put out. The FAA, along with with some other, you know, senior safety, safety guys, um put out this thing called the advisory circle, uh one 20, uh ADB and and um, you know, they, they, this gives guidelines for what to do with an onboard fire with a lithium battery, what to do with an onboard fire with a lithium battery, and they say the device needs to be fully extinguished and cooled before putting them into the containment bag. The burn bags do not contain smoke, extinguish the fire or protect the crew and passengers engaged in firefighting. So you know, if you think about it in comparison, you pull that device out and you know what they've been doing is blasting with a Howland fire extinguisher, which you know, could you imagine sitting there and with that going on?

Speaker 2: 11:52

and you know hoping that and they're just dousing it with water, which is not doing anything, and they're hoping that it'll cool and it won't propagate before putting, it could potentially propagate, it could potentially explode. All that smoke that's coming off of it is is poisonous.

Speaker 1: 12:25

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 12:25

I mean it's, it's completely nuts. And the funny thing about it is like we know who to talk to, like we know who are procuring these, these safety products. We know what. What devices are on every plane, like all these different commercial flights, um, and and and we're. You know I'm out here hammering these guys saying, hey, you know, we have the ul certification. This is how the device works. This is what differentiates us from the containment bags, and and, you know it's. It's just crickets over there, and and, and and it's. You know, obviously ours aren't cheap, but but you know, a lot cheaper than having to turn the plane around and refund all the passengers, yeah exactly and all the disruptions and and even the potential health, you know hazards that can come out of the fumes, as you mentioned earlier.

Speaker 1: 13:15

Um, so tell me the PG-100, you have two patents on this and it's UL certified. So tell us, or tell the audience, what the significance of getting a UL certification means.

Speaker 2: 13:28

So the UL certification was? You know the UL board was made up of, you know safety advisors, some other, you know other people that are in the containment device and you know it was just a rigorous test where I think we had to do our run our box 12 different times because there's no exact, consistent sort of response for thermal runaway it. It is always different, and that's what's really scary about this is that it's not a one size fits all, and so that's why we needed a box that had the capabilities of handling a lot of different reactions. And in our tests, when we had the battery explode, we remember the guy who was doing the testing was like that is the first time. We remember the guy who was doing the testing was like that is the first time that we've ever seen that out of like the 100 tests that they've been doing on all these other bags, because everyone's trying to get the UL certification, because the advisory circular you know, which the FAA issued, came out and said and there was a meeting with Congress last week as well saying you know, we're not, we don't endorse any products because they don't.

Speaker 2: 14:44

But you know, the only thing we do endorse is is the UL 5800 certification. And so what they would do is is is is make sure you know they worked as as such. And then we also tested the temperature of the box to make sure that the box wasn't heating up and wasn't hot to the touch. So we have, like, specifically made stainless steel handles with these sort of rubber coverings so that that those aren't hot to the touch, but they test the whole bag and I don't know the exact temperature that that it cannot exceed. But you know the whole box box cannot heat up to a certain temperature and that's why they gave us that UL. That's what we needed to pass the UL certification and we are the only containment vice with that certification.

Speaker 1: 15:33

Yeah, that is very significant and I'm very familiar with UL. My background is in electrical engineering, so Underwriter Labs, that's a very big deal to get that and it's the mark of quality and safety. So, aside from everything you've mentioned, all the great features that your product has, that really puts you head and shoulders above the rest. As far as cost, without getting into the exact details, of course, you've got competitors. Of course, as you mentioned, the airlines, um, are, are, the major carriers are already using or have some kind of device on board, is, is, is the PG 100 significantly more, is it twice as much, five times as much about the same in terms of costs compared to what's out there.

Speaker 2: 16:12

Now you know there's a range, um, you know, and you can see it on our website, if you're buying one box, we're around $5,000. There's bags that range from $600 to $3,000. In my mind, we're not that significantly much higher boxes are, are you know it's? It's a completely different, different thing than than, uh, these bags, it's, you know, you can see, I mean ours are not cheap to make um, and in order for them to to withstand um sort of the pressure and and the potential of the batteries, we, we can't skip on anything. I mean our filters are are the highest, highest brand of charcoal filters that you can buy. All our stainless steel claps, it's insulated with a liner. That, again, because the battery's explosion is so intense, our construction is extremely, extremely expensive.

Speaker 1: 17:21

Yeah, and robust, I mean to take those kinds of pressures, I imagine.

Speaker 2: 17:24

Yeah, and I mean you know, and the reality is, I mean you know, depending on the size of the plane, but you know, this isn't you're going to want to have one in the cockpit. You're going to want to have one in the middle. You're going to have one in the back.

Speaker 2: 17:34

I mean that, that you know these guys aren't looking at like just one one for the plane.

Speaker 2: 17:42

But but again, I mean you know, and we work with the military and the government and you know the DOD as well. We sold some to them and you know, as I said earlier, what's the cost of downing the plane, refunding the clients, the passengers. You know beyond all the safety risks, but you know, for anything in the military it's like you know they could be on a two, three day month long mission for you know millions and millions of dollars. And if they have to abort the mission, I mean that is costly or if they're trying, it could expose them as well and put them in danger. If they're in a place where they're trying to, you know, not be seen, etc. And the next thing, you together. In my mind it's kind of a no-brainer and we're starting to definitely see a shift. I mean we had an inquiry from the Marines just this morning and as people are starting to get aware of the product and see the pros and the cons, it's really a no-brainer.

Speaker 1: 18:54

Yeah, I agree. Yeah, I agree. And given all the you know features and protection measures that you've mentioned, with your product physically, how big is this?

Speaker 2: 19:04

uh, in terms of size, yeah, so it's 22 by 11 and then it's four inches deep, um, 12 pounds, and and that you know we suggest it usually goes in, you know, the overhead. It can fit in the overhead. Okay, some of the bags are similar in size. They beat us in weight, obviously because they're just, you know, canvas bags. Yeah, um, but, um, you know we, you know that that's when we it used to be plain guard. This product was prior to when you know we sort of acquired it and and and and dialed it in Um, and, and you know it was 20 pounds originally. So that's one thing that we've worked on is, is, is getting the weight down, um, but but that that is something that comes up. But you know again, it, it, it, it fits well enough and, and you know, 12 pounds this is not the end of the world.

Speaker 1: 19:59

Yeah, no, that's not large or heavy at all. I mean, I'm thinking it can even fit in smaller. You know, citation type aircraft, private aircraft we're on a lot as well.

Speaker 2: 20:08

Yes, since you know so, and a little background on on on on our company, who we are, who I work for. You know they're a private aviation company, they're a charter and that's that's where, where it all started, and and and they were looking for a product because you know, it was on the radar that this was, this was a growing threat, and so you know, as a private charter company like we, we needed to find something that protected us, our clients, their assets, I mean. You know we're sitting there being like what we're going to just let the ped sit there and burn until it cools down, like you know what's that going to do to?

Speaker 2: 20:49

you know, the the plane right um and then, and then, and then, you know, and obviously the in-flight pilot and and and flight attendants, whoever's on board, um, and and we're really the only device that that protects the user as well, and and and so, like you know, most of our competitors are, you know, they see a potential for for economy money, so they went out and built the bags. Like you know, we built this out of necessity for, you know, for our clients and our the safety of our staff. And you know, it's definitely, I think, a little bit of a different story for us, and that's why we were so committed to getting this UL certification. And you know, if our price was down significantly, we'd probably be a little bit more appealing to some of these lower cost aircrafts, but but you know, but then we wouldn't be able to stand behind our product and and also we wouldn't feel confident of having our product on board.

Speaker 2: 21:55

And you know we have our products on all of our, all of our planes, of course, right.

Speaker 1: 22:01

Yeah, absolutely yeah, and so this sounds like the shelf life is pretty significant. In other words, once you purchase this um, it probably can last a long time, of course, unless it has to get used. But what's the projected or estimated shelf life for the pg100?

Speaker 2: 22:19

you know we have, we we haven't. We've had them for six or seven years and we haven't seen one have any issues. So you know we kind of put 10 years just to sort of protect ourselves. But but as long as what happens? If you've got somebody opening and closing and opening and closing it, of course the handles and the slide mechanisms and things like that will slowly deteriorate over time. But but if, if they're not getting messed with, which they shouldn't be you know, we think these things will last forever.

Speaker 2: 22:52

I mean, we had some issues with the filter prior where, where the filters needed to be replaced every couple of years, we fixed that, we put a little cover on the filters to protect them and we upgraded those and we don't have that issue anymore. So you know, the shelf life on these are extremely long and you know you look at some of these other competitors, these bags, I mean they have zippers, they have Velcros.

Speaker 2: 23:17

You know, all these things that really inherently deteriorate over time. And our construction is very simple, very few pieces, and so you know we have a very long, you know undetermined at this point. But kind of our thing is, you know we say 10 years and no maintenance either. And you know a big thing for us too, that I really think that you know a big thing for us too, that I really think that you know. You know I go on these flights now, as you will now, and complete fear of the thermal runaway and yeah, I'm sorry, you'll never be no.

Speaker 1: 23:58

Like I said earlier, new fear unlocked.

Speaker 2: 24:00

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 24:02

You know you got me. I'm asking about the sizes because you know I fly in sesna's piper smaller airplanes and I mean it's it's a slightly different situation but my gosh, it's like it wouldn't be a terrible, I think, idea to have one of those on board, because anything can happen and, as you mentioned earlier, we're getting more devices in our lives, not less, right. I mean, the proliferation is just. You know, even your watch, your smartwatches now have lithium batteries, so it's just everywhere and it's only going to get even more prolific. So we've talked about the features and the benefits of the PG100 overall. What is the training necessary or required for someone to get proficient at using these?

Speaker 2: 24:43

Yep, so that's a great question. And another, you know, big differential from from our products to the other products is is is ours is very intuitive. It's we have a training video online and, and we're also a part of a bigger, the PG100 lithium fire guard is also part of. We have another platform that is LithCon, which has lots of other charging devices, which are more are devices that are used for charging and battery storage and things like that use for charging and battery storage and things like that. But but so you know, we're currently building a platform that's going to be training for all those things, but right now we have a video that's on our website.

Speaker 2: 25:31

It's super intuitive to use and that's one of those things that that you know, this is probably going to happen once or twice maybe in our in-flights life where they're going to have to have to use these things.

Speaker 2: 25:43

I mean, hopefully, and and you know, this thing's going off, it's a it's you're going to be panicked.

Speaker 2: 25:50

You're going to have, you're going to have your passengers like, oh my God, this thing's smoking and it's about to go on flames, and if anybody knows about thermal runway, they're going to be running, running for the Hills, but so you just open the claps, you pull the the box apart, you put it over it, you close it, you put the water in. It is so intuitive. And in some of these other bags I mean one of them has like a pillow where you got to open the bag and you put the pillow on it and the pillows melts into the device and then you got to pick up the device with a thermal blanket even though the advisory circle says do not pick up the device till it's totally cooled Right and then get the device from the blanket into the containment bag. And there's so many steps and ours is just, it's so easy and intuitive to use. And ours is just it's so easy and intuitive to use. And again, I think that's something that really really separates us with this product.

Speaker 1: 26:55

Beyond, and we have the user protection in it as well, which the other ones all lack. Yeah, and there's something to be said about an intuitive procedure. When there's an emergency going on, right, when people are screaming panic, whatever, um, if, if it's three or four steps and they're and they're intuitive, you're a lot more likely to you know, follow them and see them to completion, versus, like you mentioned, with the other products, the pillow and everything else going on. That sounds like a lot of back and forth, uh, in a very stressful situation.

Speaker 2: 27:20

It's, it's, it's crazy to to to put that on um, the, the, the in flight, to to do that. And I asked these flight attendants when I'm on these planes just to sort of get a feel. I'm like what containment device is, and they're like, oh, some bag, how do you use it?

Speaker 1: 27:39

And that's how do you use it.

Speaker 2: 27:41

And most of them have no idea and and that is, like you said, not reassuring, borderline, horrifying, and and so we want something that's intuitive to use. We want some assimilation with all these flights and I think that is is something that an issue that we've run into is is is like they're going to put them on on some of these planes. They want to put them on all the planes, yeah, and and and that's that's where it's like. It's it's a pretty big nut and but, but it's just this is going to be continuing to happen more and more. I mean, we've had 15 lithium incidents the FAA has reported. You can see it, they on site, they on their site, they, they, they log it and they constantly update it. We've had 15 so far that have been reported.

Speaker 2: 28:34

Who knows what has actually happened and and so it's continuing to build. We know it's going to continue to build. We know it's going to continue to build and that's why, again, we're also involved in some other products that are more geared towards battery storage, safely, safety. One of our products that we're the North American distributor this company called Fisacon is the one that developed this product and we're, again, the exclusive North American distributor is the Racklin box, and the Racklin box is a charging box, and I'm sure you've heard of all the e-bike batteries that have been going up to have a safe storage and and um a spot to a separate room dedicated to charging that that has the ability to shower and and put water on these devices.

Speaker 2: 29:35

Um, and these poor bike owners are like we can't, we're gonna, let alone we don't have the room to afford to build a whole separate room for all these charging and as of yesterday, uh, san francisco just released a press release that said that that our box, the rackland box, that that that where the distributor of is is, is approved and will suffice for for their new standard. Um, uh, which is really exciting, so like we're really at the forefront of lithium-fired containment, of safe charging and all those things, whether it's planes, whether it's buildings, government maritime, dod, et cetera. We are making it happen. We're constantly upgrading our products, making them stronger and and and doing our diligence, and so this is a field that that we truly feel that we're going to be, you know, on the forefront and and and continue to be in the future. So it's not just a money grab for us that we see that, that this is, there's an opportunity here. I mean, we're really invested in everybody's safety our clients, their assets are in flight, our pilots, et cetera.

Speaker 2: 30:53

So it's, it's cool and it's exciting. Honestly, it's, it's it sells itself. And I'm just making the connections and telling the story. And I'm just making the connections and telling the story. And we were even with some lobbyists in Washington DC the other day working on trying to get these products into certain places, and it's like when these guys hear this story, which I feel like you're in that boat now too, juan. It's really a no brainer how superior our product is and we stand by it, and it's a pretty cool thing.

Speaker 1: 31:26

Well, you know, I've been a fan and a student of aviation my entire life. I'm always fascinated by it. There's always something else to learn, and in this case, something else to learn and something else to fear. But all kidding aside, I think this is an excellent device. I think, honestly, every homeowner eventually should have one, because you know everybody's got a fire extinguisher in their kitchen or somewhere right, or they should. I think this is another thing that maybe again, with all these electronic devices everywhere, it's only going to become more and more prevalent, and maybe there can be a home version of this that you know could be provided or offered. I don't think it'd be a bad idea agreed.

Speaker 2: 32:05

I mean we were talking to insurance companies and, and, and I mean I think in five years or so, you will see this product in every house, in every uh uh office building, at, at the terminals, on the planes. It's, it's, this is a, this is a fire, this is the new fire extinguisher, because these are what are going to catch on fire, and you're totally right on that.

Speaker 1: 32:34

Nick, thank you so much for your time. I really hope this brings awareness and gets more people looking at your product and hopefully eventually purchasing the product as well. The website is lithiumfireguardcom. I'll leave links, of course, in the show notes as well, and my guest today has been Nick Dunbar. He, of course again, is the VP of Lithium Fireguard with their wonderful product, the PG100.

Speaker 2: 32:59

Yeah, and Juan, I wanted to say to you our new website as well. Lithium Fireguard is specific to this product, but if you want to see any of the other charging products that we have as well, the Racklin box that I talked about for safe battery charging is lithconus and that's up and running and that's got some of these other devices on there and and some other great information as well. So you know, give, give that a check if you've got your e-bike charging at home, etc. So, um, uh, yeah, there's lots of good stuff and I really, really appreciate your time and your attention to this, to this matter nick, thanks again, and I'll include that uh lithconus link as well in the show notes.

Speaker 2: 33:43

All right, Brett.

Speaker 1: 33:43

Enjoy your day you too. Thanks again. We'll talk soon. Be well. Thanks for listening to the Pilot Photog Podcast. Be sure to subscribe to this podcast and the YouTube channel as well. I will leave links in the description slash show notes below. Now you know PilotPhotogcom.